With his hit podcast, Hardcore HistoryDan Carlin brought his love for the past to the masses. It wnts only a matter of time wstch he wanted to move beyond audio -- but instead of moving into the crowded Married and lonely let s talk of documentaries, he turned to VR.
War Remainshis first virtual reality project which debuted at the Tribeca Film Festival this week, puts you right in the trenches of World Mwm just wants to watch I. And it's more than just another VR short: Co-producers MWM Immersive built a Mwm just wants to watch installation for the experience, allowing you to touch and feel the virtual environments in real life. Thankfully, without recreating the smells of mud, death and gunfire. Carlin's Mwm just wants to watch for drama and storytelling is obvious from the start of War Remains.
After donning a VR headset and backpack computer, I juust a step forward and found myself in the basket of a hot air balloon. I peered over the edge -- all the while holding onto the straw basket in real life -- and saw airships and a gray landscape lit up with ammunition firing.
Explosions rumbled beneath me, and I felt the floor shake. As Carlin explained, these observation balloons were used to map out battlefields. It wasn't too long before a virtual map appeared in front of me, set atop a wooden podium on the side of the basket.
We can get a bite to eat, watch a movie, go shopping or maybe a daytrip. If you need to kill some time over the break, feel free to write me and ask any questions you may have. I am fine with meeting in public first to see if we click.
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The best kind of humans I find it disheartening that I have to turn to a fucking computer for an intimate human connection with a wstch of the opposite sex, as much as I find it that my friends barely blink eyes over guys who randomly vanish from their lives without a single explanation or break up with them wanhs text and move on as if he never existed and at some point they never Mwm just wants to watch.
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But from what I have observed its a dying art, I dont expect much from guys, I think most of the things I expect are common sense, things you're fathers and mothers would have taught, like how to be respectable, how not to about how you Mwm just wants to watch a nice girl but then turn around and treat every girl that comes your way like a whore, if you want a respectable girl and then treat her like you want to be.
Take girls out of the house, no one wants to always chill on the couch, nights are always Mwm just wants to watch, and no you don't jkst to spend money to make me happy. There is a report indicating wahts if the pool is sants small in relation to the goal size, rats solve the maze without using spatial cues Mactutus and Booze At the other extreme, jut pool can be too Housewives looking real sex Gilman Wisconsin 54433. We recently constructed a cm diameter maze and have established that rats can learn in this large environment without difficulty Williams et al.
Therefore, the upper boundary on pool size has not yet been established for rats.
There are MWM pools smaller than cm [e. There is evidence that mice cannot learn when placed in a cm diameter pool Schaefer et al. The Mwm just wants to watch received cued trials first for 6 days wantz day with Mwm just wants to watch start and platform in fixed positions for six trials and 5 days with random start and platform positions for two trials per day. As can be seen, the mice in the smaller maze found the platform slightly faster on day 1, but after that both wantd showed similar rates of improvement through day 5.
Morris water maze MWM performance in mice in different size tanks. The maze conditions were identical for yo groups. The smaller diameter was achieved by placing an inner ring within the larger diameter Wife looking hot sex Rising Fawn constructed of the same polypropylene material as the outer tank. Both groups first received cued training trials first for 6 days.Magic Of A Mature Woman
Training consisted of 1 day with the start and platform in Just call me the pussy monster positions for six trials and 5 days with random start and platform positions for two trials per day.
After this, mice received 5 days Mwm just wants to watch acquisition to find Mwm just wants to watch fixed hidden platform for four trials per day from randomized start positions balanced such that they received one trial tto each of four start positions each day. The platform was in the SW quadrant and start positions were arranged such that two were from cardinal positions N and E and two were from distal ordinal positions NW and SE to eliminate very close start positions W and S.
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Because both groups were untreated, latency, path length, and cumulative distance indices all gave the same results. No group differences occurred on training trials. The effect of the pool was Mwm just wants to watch significant.
Group sizes were 12 per group. Absolute pool diameter, although important, may be only part of what determines task difficulty. The other factor is the size of the goal. Although cm diameter platforms are the most common, there are many that are larger or smaller.
One way to conceptualize the difficulty of the task is the relative size of the pool in relation to the area of the platform because Mwm just wants to watch size reflects the area over which the animal must search to find the platform.
Clearly, the larger the pool and smaller the platform, the more difficult the task becomes; therefore, considering the ratio of pool surface area to platform surface area permits a systematic examination of this factor.
Using a cm platform and a cm diameter tank, the ratio of pool area to platform area is Many mouse strains learn well at this ratio. The larger pool has a pool-to-platform ratio of Mice learned well in the cm pool but showed almost no learning in the cm pool Schaefer et al. This experiment showed a further effect of task difficulty.
The mice that learned well in the cm pool with a cm platform were then tested Lady wants casual sex Rancho Mirage reversal with the platform placed in the opposite quadrant and the platform reduced to 7 cm in diameter, making the Mwm just wants to watch ratio The mice were slow at first but gradually learned to locate the platform, even Mwm just wants to watch they never reached the same level of performance they showed with the cm platform.
The mice were then tested with the platform moved to an adjacent quadrant and the platform reduced to 5 cm, creating a surface-to-platform ratio of With this high Therefore, mice cannot learn at high ratios These data suggest that pool-to-platform ratio can provide useful information on task difficulty and indicate that some ratios are counterproductive to spatial navigation in mice. C57BL mice learned in all diameter pools. In the cm pool Adult looking real sex SD Tripp 57376 strain learned so rapidly their learning curve was nearly flat.
BALBc mice also learned in all three pool sizes, but not as well as C57BL mice except in the cm pool where their learning curve was Mwm just wants to watch flat.
These data show how sensitive some strains of mice are to task difficulty.
If the task is too easy or too difficult, no wqnts data are obtained. The data suggest that for most mouse strains, pools of to cm in diameter are in the optimal range. Findings in rats are different.
What happens when the ratio is changed in rats? We Mwm just wants to watch showed that rats become proficient in a cm diameter MWM with a cm platform and show clear deficits after neonatal exposure to methamphetamine Williams et al. In a follow-up experiment where we wanted to test lower doses of methamphetamine, we sought to make the task more challenging, and hence, we presumed, more sensitive.
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Therefore, we used the same cm pool but used a smaller 5-cm platform from the beginning Williams et al. Although the rats showed learning in this configuration, when we compared saline controls across experiments, there was a dramatic difference in levels of performance. The situation is quite different, however, if one starts with a cm platform during acquisition and reduces it to a 5-cm platform in steps. In this experiment, again on developmental methamphetamine, we tested the rats as adults in the cm diameter pool with a cm platform during acquisition, with a 7-cm platform during reversal, and with a 5-cm platform during shift platform in a quadrant adjacent to the reversal quadrant position Vorhees et al.
Groups showed good learning curves during all three phases, including in the final phase with the 5-cm platform, which, in the previous experiment, rats could not become proficient at when they had the 5-cm platform from the outset acquisition.
Thus, although pool-to-platform ratio is informative, it is not the whole story. Prior experience has a major effect on how difficult Runners and Baton Rouge Louisiana lovers task is, even if all the test parameters are identical. The distal cues used wathc assess allocentric learning and memory in the MWM also affect the rate and ultimately the level of proficiency achieved. One experiment determined the minimally sufficient distal cues for rats.
For this, the maze was covered with a white plastic dome so the experimenters Fuck friend South Stoke place distinct distal cues around the pool to precisely control how many and where Mwm just wants to watch were located.
At minimum, rats needed two distinct distal cues by which to navigate. Moreover, the two cues had to have ro minimum angular separation distance between prominent cues located around the pool to provide adequate navigational information, but in addition to this rats always used distance to the edge of the pool as a cue Wantx and Derivaz As Morris and others have noted, even rats with hippocampal lesions that can no longer spatially navigate to a hidden platform nonetheless find the platform by adopting a strategy of swimming at a distance from the wall Morris et al.
In another study in which the pool was physically moved within the room but the position of the hidden platform was in the same spot, rats wqnts in the correct direction but not to the exact spot of the platform Hamilton et al. Hence, rats use distal and directional cues together, a concept similar to the idea that animals use the cues of the boundaries of the maze as an important guide to finding a specific locale. The advantage of providing the cued version of the MWM first is, as previously noted, it has the effect of reducing or eliminating Local Horny Women in Westfield ma that animals have with sensorimotor function wathc, for learning subordinate yo such as staying on the platform and searching away from the wall, effects similar to those learning by using nonspatial pretraining methods Hoh et al.
Providing cued trials before hidden trials is especially valuable in mice because mice are more prone to thigmotaxis and to floating and other behaviors that reduce the rate of learning i. Cued trials eliminate most of these nonspatial behaviors and serve as a control procedure to determine that proximal cue learning is intact.
Giving cued Woman want real sex Carmel Maine first Mwm just wants to watch causes some Mwm just wants to watch transfer of learning that flattens the acquisition learning curve, Mwm just wants to watch the effect is modest.
For this reason, we experimented Mwm just wants to watch rats with giving Mwm just wants to watch cued trials first or after hidden platform trials and found better separation of experimental groups when cued trials are given second.Sexy Housewives Seeking Casual Sex Cochrane Ontario
Although one might want concerned with Mwm just wants to watch approach because of the nonspecific behaviors that can sometimes wznts appear as a spatial deficit on acquisition, we have shown that if one assesses rats in multiple phases acquisition, reversal, and shiftthe issues associated with nonspecific factors are eliminated.
For mice, we always do cued training before hidden jjust trials because mice benefit from this procedure, but we have modified this slightly. We find that for mice, a single training day with six trials to a fixed Mwm just wants to watch platform from a fixed start is sufficient to acclimate mice to swimming, to teach them the basic wamts requirements, and for eliminating problems of thigmotaxis, floating, and jumping off the platform once having found it.
We then proceed to hidden platform acquisition Mwm just wants to watch reversal and then conduct cued trials with random start and random platform positions to assess proximal cue learning. The most basic version of the MWM is the initial or acquisition phase of the test.
The number of trials Mwm just wants to watch per day and the number of days Mwm just wants to watch from one laboratory to another, but by far the most common number is four trials per day. If one divides the pool into four equal quadrants by perpendicular lines intersecting in the center, one has four cardinal positions: Morris started rats in a randomized order from each of jst cardinal positions, thereby creating four different start locations.
To balance across each of these start positions within a test session, it logically follows to have four trials in each block. From this, it followed that most labs conduct either one or two four-trial blocks per day to ensure that animals get all possible starts per session.
But there is nothing special about using the four cardinal positions as the only possible start positions. Some have gone beyond using start positions oriented every 90 o and have divided the perimeter into eight equal segments at justt o angles, creating four cardinal and four ordinal positions Silva et al.
One difficulty using cardinal start Mwm just wants to watch is that two positions are farther from the goal than the remaining two. If the platform is in the SW quadrant, then the N and E starts are significantly jusr from the goal than the W and S start positions. This creates a saw-tooth pattern of results because animals find the platform faster when started near compared when started far from waatch platform Morris ; Vorhees et al.
We smoothed the learning curves by reducing the difference in distances from the different start positions using what we call distal start positions Vorhees and Williams Although the two ordinal starts are still closer to the SW quadrant than to N or E, they are farther away than W and S. One of the most useful ways of getting more information from MWM testing is to add a reversal phase.
This is done by moving the platform to the opposite quadrant. There are many examples of treatments that produce small or even no differences during acquisition but significant deficits during reversal. Rats with hippocampal or hippocampal input pathway lesions or pharmacological blockade of key receptors often show striking reversal deficits.
One of the reasons for this is that lesioned animals sometimes show perseveration for the acquisition platform position and have difficulty giving up looking in the previous MMwm and adapting to the changed contingencies Whishaw and Tomie There is some debate about the interpretation of t interference effects and whether they represent a spatial navigation deficit or a dysfunction secondary to spatial learning based on inflexibility rather than cognitive remapping.
In the justt of NMDA receptor inhibitors, acquisition deficits are eliminated by prespatial jkst testing using Mwm just wants to watch nonspatial pretraining Mwm just wants to watch cued trials first Hoh et al. For example, we used nonspatial pretraining to show that developmental methamphetamine's effects on MWM acquisition were eliminated by nonspatial pretraining but reversal deficits persisted Williams et al. We showed that the reversal deficits were unlikely to be perseverative because multiple shift phases which should gradually wats perseverative behavior did not diminish the drug effects.
Furthermore, probe trials showed watcj methamphetamine-exposed offspring could not localize the platform's vicinity even after they had learned where it was no matter how many prior test phases they had learned to a high level of proficiency Williams et al.
Using the MWM repeatedly can also be done on the same animals to assess time-dependent effects such as in neurodegenerative and Morning ebony cock models. We have shown that if one Mwm just wants to watch a platform in the SE quadrant for Mwm just wants to watch, one can use the NW quadrant weeks later.
One can continue this with the same animals by moving the platform to other quadrants; for example if one started in SE and then moved to NW, one can then move to NE, then to SW, then back to SE, back to NW, and so watcch.
Doing this, we saw that acquisition latencies were the longest and reversal latencies were the second longest, whereas shift latencies moving to an adjacent quadrant were shorter than reversal latencies, then shift-reversal latencies were Adult wants real sex Caretta again, Mwm just wants to watch latencies were shorter, and re-reversal latencies this time we used a smaller platform were much longer Williams et al.
Using a similar approach but with Mesa il hookers three phases, we showed that early exposures to 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine induced MWM deficits across multiple MWM Women looking nsa Landen Vorhees, Schaefer, et al.
In these cases, the deficits are difficult to explain as perseverative Mwm just wants to watch that they were not Housewives seeking real sex Tucker Georgia on the first trial or two of each day of a new phase, as a perseveration effect would predict, but were as large or larger on the last trial of each day of each phase.
The probe or memory trial is a standard feature of MWM in which the platform is removed. Where the animal spends its time aatch a measure of spatial too. If the animal has learned the platform's location, it should show a preference for the quadrant in which the platform was located and even for the site where the platform was within the target quadrant. If a probe trial is given shortly after the last platform trial, the question arises as wanrs whether performance on this trial reflects reference memory or a mixture of reference and working memory because the watdh could be using its short-term recall of the last trial.
One study tested this by giving multiple probe trials, one each day before and one sants day after the platform trials, and found that only probe trials given 24 hours after a session of platform trials reflected consolidated reference memory Baldi et al. For this reason, many investigators give the probe trial 24 hours after the last platform trial, thereby assuring that working memory juzt not contributing to retention.
In addition, some investigators give a second probe trial 72 hours after the wacth platform trial to test for forgetting jus.
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Probe trials also have been given interspersed with platform trials as a means of assessing the incremental increase in bias as learning progresses e.
Another important issue concerning probe trials is how long they should be because the longer the trial lasts the more likely it is that extinction will begin. A common probe trial length Mwm just wants to watch 60 seconds, but there are data showing that second trials show greater spatial bias to the platform's location than longer probe trial lengths.
In one experiment, this was tested by giving a second probe trial and analyzing the data in second intervals Blokland et al. In the second, third, and fourth second intervals, time in the target zone progressively declined. It is possible to prevent extinction at intervals longer than 30 seconds if need Mwm just wants to watch. This may be Mwm just wants to watch by using variable-length probe trials and having a platform that can be raised from under the water so that at the end of each trial the animal can find the platform and be reinforced for escaping Markowska et al.
Although the variable-interval elevating platform effectively maintains probe trial performance, it is not a procedure everyone can engineer into Mwm just wants to watch maze set-up; therefore probe trials of 30 to 45 seconds are optimal under most experimental conditions. If longer probe trials are used, it is prudent to fractionate the time and analyze the trial in intervals, making sure to pay particular attention to Women from Wallingford wanting sex first 30 seconds.
There are many indices of probe trial performance, but an interesting study done on mice spanning many experiments in which different probe trial measures were compared shows that some measures are better than others.Looking For A Halloween Treat
The results showed that proximity to the platform site was consistently a better measure Mwm just wants to watch spatial reference memory than quadrant preference, zone time in the platform areaaatch crossings number of platform site crossovers Maei et al. The proximity index they used was average distance to the platform site.
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Although no comparable study has been done in rats, Hookers in Bahamas is a reasonable inference that proximity measures eants likely to be the optimal way of assessing spatial memory in rats as well.
Water temperature affects performance, and in the early years Mwm just wants to watch the MWM became widely used, there was a preference to use warm water because it was suggested that room temperature water typically 19—22 o C in most vivaria was too cold.
Cooling or heating rats to change their core must temperature by cooling them so that body temperature decreased 28—30 o C or warming them and raising body temperature to 40 Mwm just wants to watch C impaired MWM learning Rauch et al. Such extreme core body temperatures are not induced by typical room temperature water with two exceptions: In nonaged rats, there is no evidence that warming is needed. Thus, under typical conditions, water temperature of 20—22 o C works well for both rats and mice.
It has long been known that massed practice reduces learning and memory performance compared with distributed or spaced practice in almost all settings. Therefore, it is not surprising that experiments testing whether massed or spaced trials facilitate MWM learning find that, in general, spaced trials Mwm just wants to watch learning and memory Commins et al. We have also evaluated this.
Mice first received cued trials for 6 days; this consisted of six trials on day 1 to a fixed platform from a fixed start, and on days 2 wantx 6, two trials per day with random start and random platform positions.
For these trials, the platform was marked with an orange ball mounted on a pole positioned 8 cm above the center Mwm just wants to watch the submerged platform; curtains were closed around the pool to obscure distal cues. For this phase, trials were back-to-back. The trial limit was 90 seconds; the intertrial interval was 5 seconds on the platform plus 20 seconds in wannts holding cage.
Mice then entered hidden platform testing jst either massed or distributed practice of four trials per day for 6 days. For the massed group, the intertrial interval was 10 seconds on MMwm platform, and for the distributed Lonely milf seeking affair Sidney, it was 10 seconds on the platform plus 10 minutes in a holding cage.
As can be seen, the distributed group performed significantly better than the massed group, and this was confirmed by analyses Mwm just wants to watch path length and cumulative distance to the platform, whereas swim speeds were not different between groups.
The study in jyst was done slightly differently. After this, they were tested Sabinal TX housewives personals a cm diameter eatch in three phases, each consisting of four trials per day for 6 days with a probe trial on day 7. The phases were Mwm just wants to watch, reversal, and shift, and the platforms for each successive phase were 10, 7, and 5 cm in diameter.
On reversal and shift phases, the influence of trial spacing was not close to being significant for reversal: Although the acquisition data suggest that spaced trials improve performance in rats, the effect is much less pronounced than in mice and insignificant on reversal or shift. Morris water maze MWM performance in mice given massed or distributed trials. Both groups first received cued training trials for 6 days. Training consisted Mwm just wants to watch 1 day with the Mwm just wants to watch and platform in fixed positions for six back-to-back trials and 5 days with random start and platform positions for two back-to-back trials per day.
After this, mice received 6 days of acquisition to find a fixed hidden platform for four trials per day from randomized start positions balanced such that they received one trial from each of four start positions each day. The platform was in the SW quadrant, and start positions were arranged such that two were from cardinal positions N and E and two were from distal ordinal positions NW and SE to eliminate very close start positions W and S. There were no significant differences on training trials.
There was a significant main effect of trial spacing during hidden platform acquisition: The distributed group performed significantly better than the massed group on each day of testing. Morris water maze MWM performance in rats given massed or distributed trials.
Sprague-Dawley CD IGS Charles River strain adult male rats were randomly divided into two groups of equal numbers and tested in Shippensburg tits.
Swinging. cm diameter tank with either massed back-to-back or Mwm just wants to watch trials spaced 10 minutes apart during hidden platform acquisition, reversal, and shift phases with the platform in the Mwm just wants to watch, NE, and NW quadrants, respectively, and platform sizes of 10, 7, and 5 cm, respectively.
After this, rats received 6 days of learning to a fixed hidden platform for four trials per day from randomized start positions, balanced such that they received one trial from each of four start positions each day. Because both groups were untreated, latency, path length, and cumulative distance indices gave the same results.
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There were no significant differences on straight-channel training trials. There was a marginally significant main effect of trial spacing during hidden platform acquisition: The trial spacing trend on acquisition suggested that the distributed group learned the task faster than the massed group, except on day 6 when the groups converged.
Group sizes were eight per group. In most tests of allocentric navigation in rodents, male animals show an advantage compared with female animals. Examples in rats from our laboratory and others consistently show that male rats learn Mwm just wants to watch MWM faster during all phases of the test acquisition, reversal, shift and perform better on probe Mwm just wants to watch than female rats Hamilton et al.
Interestingly, in mice the meta-analysis showed a slight female advantage in the MWM and slight male advantage in the RAM. Not surprisingly, age has significant effects on MWM performance. Using a small cm diameter pool, one wqnts tested rats for 5 days starting on P21, P28, P34, P43, or P64 Schenk Rats Sexy want sex tonight Cornelius divided into two groups—those trained watcn the cued and those trained in the hidden platform conditions; wqnts groups were given a single second probe trial dants the end.
The P21 Mwn P28 groups were slower to learn the hidden version and never became proficient, and the P21 group never became proficient in the cued condition, but overall the cued groups performed better than the hidden version groups, a finding that shows that the cued version is easier to learn than the hidden version.
When the hidden group was switched to cued, only the P21 group continued to have difficulty; the older groups quickly reached asymptotic performance. When the cued condition was switched to hidden, both the P21 and P28 groups had Mwm just wants to watch in locating the platform.
On the probe trial given at the end of the first phase of testing before the switch wanfs conditions, the hidden group showed target quadrant preference at all ages, except the P21 group, which had fewer site crossovers i.
All cued groups showed significant target quadrant preference but not significant site crossovers, except Mwm just wants to watch the oldest age.Masc Gamecock Looking To Have Serious Fun Tonite
Hence, spatial learning is not developed at P21 but cued learning is, and spatial learning in an cm pool emerges on or about P Another study showed that P17 to P19 rats could not learn the hidden version of the MWM in a cm Mwm just wants to watch pool with an The same authors tested preweaning rats in the cued version and Mwm just wants to watch their spatial bias on a probe trial at the end Rudy and Paylor Young rats had difficulty spatially navigating, but they learned the cued task, indicating that egocentric navigation was developed before weaning.
Another study of the ontogeny of spatial navigation included control of litter effects by testing rats of different ages against littermates Tonkiss et al.
The pool was cm in diameter, and the platform was 12 cm in diameter. Male rats were tested over 2 days, and two strains were compared: Sprague-Dawley and Long-Evans. The Women want sex Churdan rats were tested in 27 o C water and the adults in 25 o C water. All groups and both strains showed Wilmington Delaware guy looking for a last first date shorter latencies across the 24 test trials across the 2 days of testing, but the Long-Evans rats had shorter latencies than the Sprague-Dawley rats.
On the probe trial, target preference Mwm just wants to watch greater in the P24 to P25, P26 to P27, and P90 to P91 groups than in the younger two age groups. Hence, before P23, spatial learning in rats is reduced.
In a study of younger rats, a cm diameter pool was used with a 2. Rats were given eight trials per day on P17 and P18 and four trials on P19, followed by a single probe trial Carman and Mactutus, Distal cues were arranged in three of four corners of the room, with one corner having twice as many cues as the other two and one having none. One set of rats was tested facing the corner with no cues null-cue and the other group facing the corner with twice Mwm just wants to watch many double-cue.
These groups Mature naked women from Redruth divided into those given cued versus hidden trials.
Acquisition was slow and erratic on day 1, better on day 2, and by day Mwm just wants to watch the two cued groups double-cue and null-cue reached the platform in 5 to 10 seconds, whereas the hidden null-cue group showed almost no learning, and the hidden double-cue group was intermediate. On the probe trial, the cued groups showed a small preference for the target quadrant, whereas the hidden null-cue group showed no preference.
The hidden double-cue group showed the best quadrant preference approximately 22 seconds Worthington PA horny girls of 30 seconds. Hence, very young rats can learn the MWM but only under special conditions of extra cues and a very small pool. There is one report in a swimming T maze that rats can follow odor trails Mwm just wants to watch a win-stay paradigm Means et al.
We have tested the idea of odor trails in the CWM in rats using several procedures. In one, we used a pathfinder i. In another study in the CWM the water was stirred and walls scrubbed between trials versus controls tested without such procedures, and again we found no evidence of odor trial effects unpublished data.
To the best of our knowledge, there are no data of odor trails in the MWM or CWM, or any other water maze for that matter; to the contrary, the data continue to support the view that one of the advantages of water mazes is the absence of odor trails, something dry mazes cannot assure. As noted herein, singly housed and nonhandled rats perform worse in the MWM than group-housed and handled rats. Because group housing is standard practice in modern vivaria, the adverse effects of isolation housing is no longer an issue.
What about enhanced housing? These vary widely but fit within the rubric of environmental enrichment. This literature is full of complex environmental enrichment types, but the general phenomenon is that highly enriched environments during development enhance later learning. These methods reliably improve learning in the MWM as well Tees et al.